Because marriage is an ever-evolving experience, we constantly shift, change and, in some cases, start over. In It’s No Secret, couples share thoughts about commitment and tell us what they have learned along the way.
Who Dr. Julie Schwartz Gottman, 68, and Dr. John Gottman, 77
Occupations The couple, both of whom have Ph.D.’s in psychology, are the founders of the Gottman Institute, a Seattle company that helps couples build and maintain healthy relationships based on scientific studies. They are co-authors of “Eight Dates: Essential Conversations for a Lifetime of Love,” which was published in February by Workman Publishing.
Their Marriage 31 years, 9 months and counting
Through The Years
Dr. Julie Schwartz and Dr. John Gottman were married Aug. 16, 1987, before 80 people in a small synagogue in Seattle. “We had a klezmer band who play Israeli folk music,” she said. “I loved getting raised in the chairs. John was terrified because he gets altitude sickness on a ladder.”
The couple live in Deer Harbor, Wash. They have a daughter who is 28.
In 1986, Dr. Schwartz, then 35, met Dr. Gottman, then 44, at the Spotted Pony Espresso, a coffee house in Seattle. “He was very cute and had beautiful eyes behind his glasses and was wearing a black leather jacket,” she said. “He looked like a New York Jewish intellect, which was my type.”
Both had recently moved to Seattle. The coffee shop was crowded. He asked if she wanted to sit next to him. “He was a professor of psychology, I was psychologist, so we had lots to talk about,” she said. “He walked me to my car and our steps matched perfectly. His car was on the street. It was an old, dark red sedan with bench seats and had big patches of white all over it. He told me his car was voted ugliest car in the University of Washington’s parking lot. I fell in love with the car and him instantly.”
He asked for her phone number and called a few days later. The conversation lasted for hours. More calls followed, then a date. Then she was leaving to do a short speaking tour for work, which had her staying at five different hotels. “John called my job and found out which hotels I was staying at — he sent flowers to each one,” she said. “That blew my mind. We started dating when I came back.”
Four months later they moved in together. Soon after the pair was having lunch at a Chinese restaurant after going to synagogue. “John said, ‘What do you think of the idea of marriage?’ I wasn’t sure what he meant. Then realized it was a proposal,” she said. They were married six months later.
What They’ve Learned
Dr. Schwartz Gottman John and I came from very different places. He’s a researcher, I’m a clinician. He was in the labs, I was in the front lines. He loves to sit in a chair and read, I love to climb mountains. His parents were Holocaust survivors. He grew up in Brooklyn sleeping in the hallway of a one-bedroom apartment. I grew up in Oregon in an upper middle class home. He was raised as modern Orthodox. I was raised as reformed — synagogue on the high holidays. Our relationship was based on different approaches and backgrounds. We fought like cats and dogs, but we’ve worked a lot of things out.
The couple on their wedding day. They were married Aug. 16, 1987, at a small synagogue in Seattle.
What drew me to John was his ego. It was like a rock; mine was like quicksand. He has the best sense of humor and boundless curiosity. I knew I would never be bored, and I never have. He’s supports my dreams.
We’ve learned to create a dialogue about our differences and to accept them. Humor kept us alive when we had conflict. We realized we had to stay calm and focused enough to describe ourselves rather than describe each other.
I learned not to run away, to take a break and breathe. To say what I needed or what had hurt me. He’s learned to let me do that. My pauses were me thinking; he took them as I was done, so we had to learn rhythm. We’ve learned deeper understanding, which softens the edges around compromises.
He’s helped me be more patient and tolerate. I’ve become 1,000 times more self-confident. His love has been unconditional. He has seen talent in me I never saw and that took me years to own. He’s become more compassionate, humble, and less defensive.
When I met him, I looked in his eyes and saw his soul, sparkle and intellect. I knew the love we could have would be bedrock. And it has been.
Dr. Gottman I arrived in Seattle in May and dated 60 women in 10 weeks. I found most of them in the personals. Julie was No. 61. She was witty, funny and smart. She was perceptive and insightful, loving and forgiving. She still is. I call her the tiger. She’s very fierce. She’s a good protector of our family.
She’s fearless, I’m fearful. I can tell you 10 ways you can die at a picnic. I’ve learned a lot of humility and to respect her in a very deep way. When we started working together I was really arrogant and challenging. We used to have big fights about who was right; we don’t anymore. When we sit and talk about an issue, I’ve learned to examine my own self and issues. I had to go out of my comfort zone. Her point of view and clinical expertise is really smart, even when I disagree with it.
When she’s upset, I’ve learned the world needs to stop — to close the Kindle, and to listen to her, to not react, which is hard for me to do because I’m very defensive. I used to think, I’m innocent, it’s your fault. I’ve learned to shut up and listen and take her seriously before I talk about my point of view. I’ve learned that the bigger her emotion, the more depth there is behind it.
Marriage is always changing; you’re always learning, even after 30-plus years. That’s exciting and helps me feel really close to her.
Every year we go on a honeymoon for 10 days. For the last decade we’ve gone to Salt Spring Island in Canada and stayed in the same room. We ask each other three questions: What sucked about this year? What was good about this year? And what do you want next year to look like? It’s one of our rituals of connection, and that keeps us deeply connected.
